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Re: Transitive dependencies

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Re: Transitive dependencies

David07 Oct 2003 10:44
> You're confusing a partial dependency for a transitive dependency.
> A partial dependency is when an attribute is functionally dependent on only
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Office is dependent on Lecturer, Lecturer is dependent on CourseID, so
> Office is transitively dependent on CourseID.

But isn't CourseID (CourseCode) functionally dependent on Lecturer?  The
definition that I'm looking at says that:

If A -> B and B->C then C is transitively dependent on A via B *provided
that* A is not functionally dependent on B or C.

In the example you gave, A (CourseID) is *not* dependent on C (Office) but A
*is* dependent on B (Lecturer) - for each value of Lecturer there's exactly
one value of CourseID.

rkc06 Oct 2003 22:11
> > Before identifying transitive dependencies, you need to clearly identify
> the
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Have I understood the concepts correctly?  I'd like to put the student table
> in *both*  2NF and 3NF.

You're confusing a partial dependency for a transitive dependency.
A partial dependency is when an attribute is functionally dependent on only
part of the primary key.

In your base relation CourseDesc is only dependent on CourseID, Lecturer
is only dependent on CourseID and Name is only dependent on StuID.
All are partial dependencies.

Office is dependent on Lecturer, Lecturer is dependent on CourseID, so
Office is transitively dependent on CourseID.

David06 Oct 2003 13:21
> Before identifying transitive dependencies, you need to clearly identify the
> primary key.  The primary key is an attribute (or attributes!) that uniquely
> identifies every record in the relation.  Once you've done that, the
> transitive dependency should be apparent.  Hint:  Dr. Codd might well teach
> more that one Database course, but he will only have one office.

Well, StudId, CourseCode uniquely identifies every row - I think this is
probably the primary key.

I should have explained myself better: the reason I thought that StudId,
CourseCode -> Office, CourseDesc, Lecturer was a transitive dependency was
because CourseCode and Lecturer both depend on CourseDesc, and CourseDesc in
turn depends on StudId, CourseCode.  Similarly, Office depends on Lecturer
and Lecturer depends on StudId, CourseCode.

Have I understood the concepts correctly?  I'd like to put the student table
in *both*  2NF and 3NF.

Randy Harris06 Oct 2003 05:54
Before identifying transitive dependencies, you need to clearly identify the
primary key.  The primary key is an attribute (or attributes!) that uniquely
identifies every record in the relation.  Once you've done that, the
transitive dependency should be apparent.  Hint:  Dr. Codd might well teach
more that one Database course, but he will only have one office.

> Hi there,
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> I then thought that  StudId, CourseCode -> Office, CourseDesc, Lecturer
> might be a transitive dependency within student.  Is it?

David06 Oct 2003 01:46
Hi there,

I'm having some trouble identifying transitive dependencies in the student
table below

StudId    Name      CourseCode CourseDesc      Lecturer    Grade Office
'S1234', 'Jack',   'C224',     'Database',     'Codd',     'D',  381
'S1234', 'Jack',   'C225',     'Algorithms',   'Djikstra', 'P',  380
'S2345', 'Jill',   'C224',     'Database',     'Codd',     'HD', 381
'S2345', 'Jill',   'C226',     'Architecture', 'Ritchie',  'HD', 390
'S4567', 'Jack',   'C226',     'Architecture', 'Ritchie',  'D',  390
'S4567', 'Jack',   'C224',     'Database',     'Codd',     'F',  381
'S9872', 'Howard', 'Cpol',     'Politics',     'Marx',     'F',  380

I've first tried to find the functional dependencies (they may or may not be
correct)

* StudId -> Name
* StudId, CourseCode -> Name, CourseDesc, Lecturer, Grade, Office
* CourseCode -> CourseDesc, Lecturer, Office
* CourseDesc -> CourseCode, Lecturer, Office
* Lecturer -> CourseCode, CourseDesc, Office

I then thought that  StudId, CourseCode -> Office, CourseDesc, Lecturer
might be a transitive dependency within student.  Is it?

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