group vs individual user security

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Brigitte P - 20 May 2004 02:24 GMT

I have 3 secure A 2002 dbases in a Windows 2000 network environment.
1. Staff Back has all staffing information - StaffFront is the frontend for
this database with some users having RO and others having Data entry
priviliges.
2. Nursing is Frontend is connected to StaffBack with some users having
limited RO and data entry priviliges (for their department only)
3. TrainingFront have RO priviliges to staff demographic info, and data
entry and read permissions to own backend (TrainingBack)

Here is my first questions: I have set up User groups Full Priviliges (me
and one other person), Data entry with appropriate priviliges, and RO with
appropriate priviliges. However, I don't want the Nursing or Training staff
to be able to open the Staffing database (confidentiality issue), but since
they have group priviliges, they can open the switchboard of all 3
databases. At this point, I password protected each database on top of the
securities (a lot of logging in). I also attempted to give group priviliges,
but then remove Switchboard Form and Switchboard Items privileges in the
respective database. However, when I do this (and the user has the password
for some reason or another), they get an error message that they don't have
rights to the Switchboard, but the whole database window opens for them, and
they can get to the tables which they must have rights for read and
respectively write purposes. For some reason, it bypasses the startup
option, which I have set right (unchecked all, and set the switchboard as
opening form). I have code to allow me to get in.
Is there any way I can use group accounts vs. individual accounts and still
customize each database.
In my A97 version, I had set individual rights, and this worked fine, but
all my readings in A2002 suggest to use group settings.
What do I miss?

Second question: It doesn't allow me to delete the Admin user (acts like I
want to delete the Admins group, but I highlighted the Admin user).

Thanks for your help. With your help, I'm getting my conversions done.
Brigitte

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TC - 20 May 2004 05:06 GMT

What about splitting each group into three? Nurse Jones could be a member of
the NursingDataEntry group, but not of the StaffingDataEntry group, or the
TrainingDataEntry group, & so on.

As for deleting the Admin user, I don't think you can do that from the
Access user interface (but I don't have Access here to check).

HTH,
TC
(off for the day)

> I have 3 secure A 2002 dbases in a Windows 2000 network environment.
> 1. Staff Back has all staffing information - StaffFront is the frontend for
[quoted text clipped - 31 lines]
> Thanks for your help. With your help, I'm getting my conversions done.
> Brigitte

Reply to this Message

Brigitte P - 20 May 2004 08:16 GMT

Thanks, good idea!! even though I still would like to know whether you can
mix and match group and individual settings and have the individual settings
override the group settings (which was probably my original question). As to
deleting the Admin user, I'll add that account to the user group only and
give no rights to Users, which should solve that issue (hopefully).
Brigitte

> What about splitting each group into three? Nurse Jones could be a member of
> the NursingDataEntry group, but not of the StaffingDataEntry group, or the
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
> > Thanks for your help. With your help, I'm getting my conversions done.
> > Brigitte

Reply to this Message

Joan Wild - 20 May 2004 14:03 GMT

> Thanks, good idea!! even though I still would like to know whether
> you can mix and match group and individual settings and have the
> individual settings override the group settings (which was probably
> my original question).

Yes you can, but it's a maintenance nightmare. You'd be better off creating
separate groups. Then your only maintenance is creating new users and
assign to groups, or deleting users. If you assign permissions to users,
then you have a lot of work every time someone leaves or someone is hired.
It would be easy to miss some permission.

> As to deleting the Admin user, I'll add that
> account to the user group only and give no rights to Users, which
> should solve that issue (hopefully). Brigitte

You can't delete it, so you can't 'add' it either. Every user is always a
member of Users Group, so your approach to deny this group permissions is
correct.

Signature

Joan Wild
Microsoft Access MVP

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Brigitte P - 21 May 2004 02:05 GMT

THANKS to all of you. The approach worked fine even though I have only 9
users and 5 groups. But the group thing is much more transparent since it
requires some planning and is a long-term solution. One pearl of wisdom I
have gained in converting secure dbases from 97 to 2002 is that it is best
to to most of the work in the native database vs. in the converted version.
I read this someplace but thought I could take shortcuts with the first
conversion (they weren't short). In my later databases I cleaned my
originial permission, compiled, repaired, compacted. Then I created a new
database (with me logged in), and all ownership and permission issues were
resolved. I just converted (first to 2000 then to 2002 using the wizzard),
used your or Lynn's advise and clicked the DAO 3.6, compiled,
compacted/repaired, set up the appropriate group permission, added the
toolbar and set up the start-up menue. This was maybe one to two hours work
and no extra gray hair. The shortcut with the wrkgrp thing for users is also
great and makes our IT people happy since they hated when I locked Access
for unsecure databases by joining the workgroup.
Thanks for patiently guiding me through -- all of you wonderful people.
Brigitte

> > Thanks, good idea!! even though I still would like to know whether
> > you can mix and match group and individual settings and have the
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> member of Users Group, so your approach to deny this group permissions is
> correct.

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TC - 21 May 2004 02:37 GMT

(snip)

> Every user is always a member of Users Group

Only when done from the UI, tho :-)

As I'm sure you know (but the OP may not), users created thru code are not a
member of any group until you make them so.

Cheers,
TC

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Joan Wild - 21 May 2004 14:24 GMT

>> Every user is always a member of Users Group
>
> Only when done from the UI, tho :-)
>
> As I'm sure you know (but the OP may not), users created thru code
> are not a member of any group until you make them so.

But you must do so.

Signature

Joan Wild
Microsoft Access MVP

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TC - 22 May 2004 08:31 GMT

> >> Every user is always a member of Users Group
> >
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> But you must do so.

Why? (seriously)

If you create a user & grant him permissions, I don't see why he
couldn't use the things that you had granted him permission to use;
even if he was not a member of any groups. (Haven't explicitly tested
this, but!)

Cheers,
TC

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Joan Wild - 22 May 2004 15:21 GMT

>> But you must do so.
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> even if he was not a member of any groups. (Haven't explicitly tested
> this, but!)

In order to work with the systems tables, all users must be a member of the
Users Group

Signature

Joan Wild
Microsoft Access MVP

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